Publication date
1/15/08
Volume
29
Number
2
The WatchTower
The Cincinnati, O., Debates
The Watchtower Magazines
/../literature/watchtower/1908/2/1908-2-1.html
 
 
 
(15-19) 
ZION'S 
WATCH 
TOWER 
ALLEGHENY, 
PA. 
insignificant 
in 
proporti(ln 
to 
the 
still 
greater 
thing's 
which 
as 
his 
disciple 
he 
would 
gradually 
come 
to 
know 
and 
to 
under­ 
stand. 
And 
is 
not 
this 
true 
with 
us 
today' 
The 
joy, 
the 
confidence, 
the 
hopes 
which 
filled 
our 
hearts 
at 
the 
beginning, 
as 
we 
came 
to 
recognize 
the 
Lord 
and 
to 
have 
a 
clearer 
under­ 
standing 
of 
the 
divine 
plan-have 
these 
not 
continually 
been 
added 
to 
by 
the 
Lord, 
so 
that 
what 
we 
first 
saw 
and 
enjoyed 
seems 
but 
small 
in 
comparison 
with 
the 
riches 
of 
grace 
and 
loving 
kindness 
and 
tender 
mercies 
revealed 
to 
our 
eyes 
of 
understanding. 
As 
our 
mental 
vision 
widens 
we 
behold 
lengths 
and 
breadths 
and 
depths 
and 
heights 
of 
the 
love 
of 
God 
sur­ 
passing 
all 
of 
our 
expectations.-Eph. 
3 
:18, 
19. 
And 
by 
faith 
we 
can 
see 
Jesus 
as 
the 
antitypical 
Jacob's 
ladder, 
as 
our 
Lord 
intimated 
to 
Nathanael. 
As 
Jacob 
in 
his 
VISIon 
saw 
a 
ladder 
reaching 
from 
earth 
to 
heaven 
and 
com· 
munications 
carried 
on 
thereby, 
so 
we, 
in 
the 
light 
of 
the 
divine 
plan 
now 
unfolding, 
see 
that 
our 
Lord 
Jesus 
and 
the 
church 
associated 
with 
him 
constitute 
the 
ladder 
of 
com­ 
munication 
between 
God 
and 
the 
world 
of 
mankind, 
which, 
during 
the 
Millennial 
age, 
will 
serve 
as 
the 
channel 
of 
favor 
by 
which 
all 
the 
families 
of 
the 
earth 
shall 
be 
blessed-by 
which 
the 
glory 
and 
blessing 
of 
the 
Lord 
shall 
be 
brought 
down 
to 
earth, 
even 
as 
now 
the 
elect, 
first-fruits 
of 
his 
human 
creatures, 
are 
being 
gathered 
from 
amongst 
men, 
that 
they 
may 
ascend 
to 
God 
as 
heirs 
of 
God 
and 
joint-heirs 
with 
Jesus 
Christ 
their 
Lord 
by 
means 
of 
the 
glorious 
change 
which 
shall 
come 
to 
them 
in 
the 
first 
resurrection, 
in 
a 
moment, 
in 
the 
twinkling 
of 
an 
eye. 
AN 
INTERESTING 
LETTER 
Dear 
BrothC'r 
Russell:- 
I 
have 
just 
returned 
home 
from 
a 
colporteuring 
tOIlt', 
occu­ 
pymg 
several 
months 
time. 
During 
the 
time 
I 
canvassed 
ahout 
117 
days 
and 
sold 
4,406 
volumes, 
averaging 
a 
little 
bet­ 
ter 
than 
37 
books 
a 
day. 
One 
little 
town 
I 
canvassed 
in 
one 
day 
and 
took 
orders 
for 
127 
books, 
and 
when 
I 
came 
back 
to 
deliver 
I 
delivered 
every 
hor>k 
ordered, 
besides 
three 
more, 
after 
three 
0 
'clock 
in 
the 
afternoon. 
In 
one 
town 
it 
was 
"noised 
about" 
that 
the 
books 
I 
was 
taking 
orders 
for 
were 
the 
DAWNS. 
In 
fact 
the 
subject. 
was 
discussed 
at 
the 
M. 
E. 
"sewing 
circle." 
One 
of 
the 
ladies 
had 
Vol. 
I., 
said 
she 
hail 
read 
it 
and 
enjoyed 
it, 
and 
wouldn't 
take 
a 
hundred 
dollars 
for 
it, 
and 
yet 
thought 
It 
wasn't 
quite 
safe 
for 
young 
people 
to 
read! 
This 
same 
lady 
called 
on 
me 
that 
evening 
at 
my 
rooming 
place 
and 
told 
me 
I 
wouldn't 
likely 
secure 
any 
more 
subscriptions 
from 
Methodists, 
and 
that 
those 
who 
had 
subscribed 
would 
likely 
countermand 
their 
or· 
ders. 
Of 
course 
this 
made 
me 
a 
little 
uneasy; 
still, 
I 
knew 
if 
I 
lost 
the 
orders, 
the 
experience 
would 
be 
good 
for 
me, 
and 
so 
I 
left 
the 
matter 
with 
the 
Lord. 
Well, 
the 
result 
was 
I 
still 
kept 
on 
taking 
orders 
from 
Methodists, 
and 
not 
a 
Methodist 
went 
back 
on 
me. 
One 
man 
whose 
wife 
didn't 
give 
me 
an 
order, 
sent 
word 
for 
me 
to 
call 
when 
I 
was 
delivering 
and 
he 
bought 
all 
six 
of 
the 
books. 
I 
met 
a 
man 
in 
a 
little 
town 
who 
said 
he 
had 
got 
the 
first 
three 
volumes 
last 
year, 
and 
that 
he 
had 
read 
all 
of 
them 
three 
times, 
that 
he 
found 
something 
new 
every 
time 
he 
read 
them 
and 
that 
they 
never 
grew 
stale. 
He 
said 
he 
has 
a 
library 
of 
over 
a 
thousand 
books. 
He 
bought 
the 
other 
three 
from 
me. 
When 
I 
find 
persons 
having 
the 
first 
three 
I 
always 
try 
to 
get 
them 
to 
take 
the 
other 
three 
and 
they 
do 
not 
often 
hesitate 
to 
do 
so. 
I 
have 
heard 
from 
a 
set 
I 
sold 
last 
year, 
that 
the 
person 
had 
read 
all 
six 
books 
three 
times 
in 
less 
than 
a 
year 
and 
considered 
them 
the 
finest 
literature 
on 
the 
Bible 
that 
he 
ever 
read. 
I 
met 
a 
dear 
old 
brother 
who 
is 
ninety-one 
years 
01(1. 
He 
is 
two 
years 
old 
in 
the 
truth, 
and 
got 
the 
truth 
by 
reading 
the 
"Debates. 
" 
With 
much 
Christian 
love, 
in 
which 
the 
household 
here 
joins, 
I 
am, 
your 
sister 
in 
the 
Lord, 
ANNA 
J. 
GILLESPIE,-Colporteur. 
VOL. 
XXIX 
ALLEGHENY, 
P 
A., 
JANUARY 
15, 
1908 
No.2 
THE 
CINCINNATI, 
0., 
DEBATES 
C. 
T. 
RUSSELL, 
affi1"m8. 
L. 
S. 
WHITE, 
denies. 
(Signed) 
(5) 
The 
Scriptures 
clearly 
teach 
that 
immersion 
in 
water, 
"in 
the 
name 
of 
the 
Father 
and 
of 
the 
Son 
and 
of 
the 
holy 
Spirit." 
of 
a 
believing 
penitent 
is 
for, 
in 
order 
to, 
the 
remis­ 
sion 
of 
sins. 
(Signed) 
(Signed) 
C. 
T. 
RUSSELL, 
affirms. 
L. 
S. 
WHITE, 
denies. 
(3) 
The 
Scriptures 
clearly 
teach 
that 
the 
punishment 
of 
the 
(finally 
incorrigible) 
wicked 
will 
consist 
of 
conscious, 
pain­ 
ful 
suffering, 
eternal 
in 
duration. 
(Signed) 
L. 
S. 
WHITE, 
affirms. 
C. 
T. 
RUSSELL, 
denies. 
(4) 
The 
Scriptures 
clearly 
teach 
tlmt 
the 
first 
resurre('­ 
tion 
will 
oceur 
at 
the 
second 
coming 
of 
Christ, 
and 
that 
only 
the 
saints 
of 
this 
Gosrel 
age 
will 
shore 
in 
it; 
hut 
thllt 
in 
the 
resurrection 
of 
the 
unjust 
(Acts 
24: 
15) 
vast 
multitudes 
of 
them 
will 
be 
saved. 
(1) 
The 
Scriptures 
clearly 
teach 
that 
all 
hope 
of 
salva­ 
tion, 
today, 
is 
dependent 
upon 
accepting 
the 
Gospel 
of 
Christ 
as 
revealed 
in 
the 
Scriptures, 
and 
that 
such 
acceptance 
is 
confined 
to 
this 
present 
life. 
(Signed) 
L. 
S. 
WHITE, 
affirms. 
C. 
T. 
RUSSELL, 
denies. 
(2) 
The 
Scriptures 
clearly 
teach 
that 
the 
dead 
are 
uncon­ 
scious 
between 
death 
and 
the 
resurrection-at 
the 
second 
com­ 
ing 
of 
Christ. 
PROPOSITIONS 
FOR 
DISCUSSION 
IN 
CINCINNATI, 
OHIO, 
BEGINNING 
SUNDAY 
EVENING 
(7.30), 
FEBRUARY 
23, 
1908, 
FOR 
SIX 
CONSECUTIVE 
EVENINGS: 
1J. 
S. 
WHITE, 
affirms. 
C. 
T. 
RUSSELL, 
denies. 
(6) 
The 
Scriptures 
clearly 
teach 
that 
the 
second 
comin~ 
L. 
S. 
WHITE. 
of 
Christ 
will 
precede 
the 
Millennium; 
and 
that 
the 
object 
of 
[4118] 
(Signed), 
Dallas, 
Tex., 
Nov. 
15, 
1907. 
ELD. 
C. 
T. 
RUSSELL, 
Allegheny, 
Pa. 
Dpar 
Sir 
and 
Brother 
:-Our 
correspondence 
has 
been 
de­ 
lightfully 
pleasant 
(for 
which 
I 
am 
truly 
grateful), 
and 
as 
we 
are 
agreed 
on 
all 
details 
for 
the 
coming 
discussion, 
am 
sending 
you 
copy 
of 
all 
the 
propositions 
we 
are 
to 
discuss, 
properly 
signed 
by 
myself, 
and 
hereby 
extend 
to 
you, 
as 
per 
your 
request, 
formal 
invitation 
to 
meet 
me 
in 
the 
discussion 
of 
these 
nropositions 
in 
Cincinnati, 
Ohio, 
beginning 
Sunday 
evenin/1;, 
February 
23, 
1908, 
and 
continuing 
six 
consecutive 
evenings, 
of 
two 
hours 
each, 
with 
one 
evening 
to 
each 
propo­ 
sition. 
I 
sup-gest 
that 
you 
ma,ke 
due 
announcement 
in 
your 
paper. 
I 
also 
trust 
that 
the 
discussion 
may 
be 
in 
the 
same 
good 
spirit 
of 
our 
correspondence, 
and 
that 
the 
same 
may 
re­ 
dound 
to 
the 
glory 
of 
God. 
Truly 
and 
fraternally, 
Some 
time 
ago 
the 
Editor 
of 
this 
journal 
was 
approached 
by 
Elder 
A. 
A. 
Bunner, 
who 
urged 
a 
debate 
on 
six 
questions 
of 
difference. 
We 
replied 
that 
we 
were 
too 
busy, 
and, 
besides, 
preferred 
to 
state 
the 
truth 
and 
leave 
it 
to 
the 
people-particu­ 
larly 
as 
we 
now 
have 
the 
eyes 
(If 
nearly 
a 
million 
readers 
every 
week. 
He 
demurred, 
and 
finally 
we 
agreed 
to 
debate 
with 
him 
if 
he 
could 
get 
the 
endorsement 
of 
the 
Christian 
denomination 
of 
Pittsburgh. 
He 
was 
unable 
to 
do 
this. 
He 
explained 
that 
the 
"Disciples" 
hereabouts 
are 
known 
as 
ProgressiVes, 
while 
he 
is 
attached 
to 
the 
Radical 
wing 
of 
the 
same 
denomination. 
The 
matter 
was 
finally 
taken 
up 
by 
the 
Editor 
of 
The 
Leader 
and 
tlhe 
Way 
of 
the 
same 
faith. 
He 
found 
in 
Texas 
Elder 
L. 
S. 
White, 
Sllpposed 
to 
be 
one 
of 
the 
ablest 
men 
of 
their 
connection. 
We 
have 
mutually 
agreed 
upon 
all 
the 
par­ 
ticulars 
for 
six 
debates 
at 
Cincinnati, 
0., 
in 
which 
we 
trust 
the 
truth 
will 
be 
vindicated 
and 
caused 
to 
reach 
new 
ears 
and 
eyes. 
The 
entire 
"Disciple" 
church 
seems 
to 
be 
aroused. 
It 
is 
expected 
that 
some 
of 
the 
railroads 
will 
grant 
conces­ 
sional 
rates 
of 
fare. 
Probably 
some 
Cincinnati 
newspaper 
will 
publish 
stenographic 
reports 
of 
the 
debates. 
The 
following 
copies 
of 
correspondence 
may 
be 
of 
interest: 
(15-19) insignificant in proportion to the still greater things which as his disciple he would gradually come to know and to understand. And js not this true with us today? The joy, the confidence, the hopes which filled our hearts at the beginning, as we came to recognize the Lord and to have a clearer understanding of the divine plan—have these not continually been added to by the Lord, so that what we first saw and enjoyed seems but small in comparison with the riches of grace and loving kindness and tender mercies revealed to our eyes of understanding. As our mental vision widens we behold lengths and breadths and depths and heights of the love of God surpassing all of our expectations.—Eph. 3:18, 19. And by faith we can see Jesus as the antitypical Jacob’s ladder, as our Lord intimated to Nathanael. As Jacob in his AN Dear Brothcr Russell :— IT have just returned home from a colporteuring tour, occupying several months time. During the time I canvassed about 117 days and sold 4,406 volumes, averaging a little better than 37 books a day. One little town I canvassed in one day and took orders for 127 books, and when I came back to deliver I delivered every bonk ordered, besides three more, after three o’clock in the afternoon. In one town it was ‘‘noised about’’ that the books I was taking orders for were the Dawns. In fact the subject, was discussed at the M. E. ‘‘sewing circle.’’ One of the ladies had Vol. 1., said she had read it and enjoyed it, and wouldn’t take a hundred dollars for it, and yet thought 1t wasn’t quite safe for young people to read! This same lady called on me that evening at my rooming place and told me I wouldn’t likely secure any more subscriptions from Methodists, and that those who had subseribed would likely countermand their orders. Of course this made me a little uneasy; still, I knew if I lost the orders, the experience would be good for me, and so I left the matter with the Lord. Well, the result was I still kept on taking orders from Methodists, and not a Methodist ZION’S WATCH TOWER ALLEGHENY, Pa. vision saw a ladder reaching from earth to heaven and communications carried on thereby, so we, in the light of the divine plan now unfolding, see that our Lord Jesus and the church associated with him constitute the ladder of communication between God and the world of mankind, which, during the Millennial age, will serve as the channel of favor by which all the families of the earth shall be blessed—by which the glory and blessing of the Lord shall be brought down to earth, even as now the elect, first-fruits of his human creatures, are being gathered from amongst men, that they may ascend to God as heirs of God and joint-heirs with Jesus Christ their Lord by means of the glorious change which shall come to them in the first resurrection, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye. INTERESTING LETTER went back on me. One man whose wife didn’t give me an order, sent word for me to call when I was delivering and he bought all six of the books. I met a man in a little town who said he had got the first three volumes last year, and that he had read all of them three times, that he found something new every time he read them and that they never grew stale. He said he has a library of over a thousand books. He bought the other three from me. When I find persons having the first three I always try to get them to take the other three and they do not often hesitate to do so. I have heard from a set I sold last year, that the person had read all six books three times in less than a year and considered them the finest literature on the Bible that he ever read, I met a dear old brother who is ninety-one years old. He is two years old in the truth, and got the truth by reading the ‘Debates, ’? With much Christian love, in which the household here joins, I am, your sister in the Lord, Anna J. GILLESPIE,—Colporteur. Vou. XXIX ALLEGHENY, PA., JANUARY 15, 1908 No. 2 THE CINCINNATI, O., DEBATES Some time ago the Editor of this journal was approached by Elder A. A. Bunner, who urged a debate on six questions of difference. We replied that we were too busy, and, besides, preferred to state the truth and leave it to the people—particularly as we now have the eyes of nearly a million readers every week. He demurred, and finally we agreed to debate with him if he could get the endorsement of the Christian denomination of Pittsburgh. He was unable to do this. He explained that the ‘‘Disciples’’ hereabouts are known as Progressives, while he is attached to the Radical wing of the same denomination. The matter was finally taken up by the Editor of The Leader and the Way of the same faith. He found in Texas Elder L. 8. White, supposed to be one of the ablest men of their connection. We have mutually agreed upon all the particulars for six debates at Cincinnati, O., in which we trust the truth will be vindicated and caused to reach new ears and eyes. The entire ‘‘Disciple’’ church seems to be aroused. It is expected that some of the railroads will grant concessional rates of fare. Probably some Cincinnati newspaper will publish stenographic reports of the debates. The following copies of correspondence may be of interest: Dallas, Tex., Nov. 15, 1907. Eup. C. T. Russeuu, Allegheny, Pa. Dear Sir and Brother:—-Our correspondence has been delightfully pleasant (for which I am truly grateful), and as we are agreed on all details for the coming discussion, am sending you copy of all the propositions we are to discuss, properly signed by myself, and hereby extend to you, as per your request, formal invitation to meet me in the discussion of these propositions in Cincinnati, Ohio, beginning Sunday evening, February 23, 1908, and continuing six consecutive evenings, of two hours each, with one evening to each proposition. I suggest that you make due announcement in your paper. I also trust that the discussion may be in the same good spirit of our correspondence, and that the same may redound to the glory of God. Truly and fraternally, (Signed), L. 8S. WHITE. PROPOSITIONS FOR DISCUSSION IN CINCINNATI, OHIO, BEGINNING SUNDAY EVENING (7.30), FEBRUARY 23, 1908, FoR SIX CONSECUTIVE EVENINGS: (1) The Scriptures clearly teach that all hope of salvation, today, is dependent upon accepting the Gospel of Christ as revealed in the Scriptures, and that such acceptance is confined to this present life. (Signed) L. 8S, Wurtz, affirms. C. T. RUSSELL, denies. (2) The Scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between death and the resurrection—at the second coming of Christ. (Signed) OC. T. RUSSELL, affirms. L. S. Wurtz, denies. (3) The Scriptures clearly teach that the punishment of the (finally incorrigible) wicked will consist of conscious, painful suffering, eternal in duration. (Signed) L. 8. Wars, affirms. C. T. RUSSELL, denies. (4) The Scriptures clearly teach that the first resurrection will occur at the second coming of Christ, and that only the saints of this Gospel age will share in it; but that in the resurrection of the unjust (Acts 24:15) vast multitudes of them will be saved. (Signed) C. T. RUSSELL, affirms. L. 8S. Wurre, denies. (5) The Scriptures clearly teach that immersion in water, ‘tin the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy Spirit.’’ of a believing penitent is for, in order to, the remission of sins. (Signed) L. S. WaHirTs, affirms. C. T. RUSSELL, denies. (6) The Scriptures clearly teach that the second coming of Christ will precede the Millennium; and that the object of {4118]

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